Global Policy Forum

Amy Goodman interviews Bill Clinton

Transcript of a rare interview of President Clinton by Amy Goodman of Pacifica Radio.

GONZALO ABURTO: Mr. President, are we going to see a substantial change in the policy to Cuba? Regarding Cuba?

PRESIDENT CLINTON: Well, let me say we were on the way to that change. Back in 1996, we had a lot of changes in my first term, in our policy towards Cuba. And we were working our way toward a reconciliation. And the Cubans were working their way toward more openness, more freedom for their farmers, and their people and we were really making headway. And then, they illegally shot down those two planes, and four people died on the planes. And the Congress passed the Cuba ... the Helms/Burton bill, so-called.

And I don't have much flexibility to do much more. What I have done with Cuba is to use the maximum extent of my legal powers to promote people to people contacts with Cuba and the Cuban people. I do believe there that the Cuban people have suffered because of the embargo, and we should do more in the area of food, in the area of medicine, in the area of people to people contacts.

And, you know, I believe that it is just a question of time to when the United States and Cuba are reconciled. And I think that the situation is tragic.

AMY GOODMAN: How do you just (Overlap)

PRESIDENT CLINTON: But it wouldn't have happened if Castro hadn't shot those planes down out of the air, in blatant violation of international law. It was just murder. There is no other ... there is no way to put a fine point on it. I mean, and we were ... sometimes I think he doesn't want the embargo lifted, because it is an excuse for the problems that he has with his own administration. Because he knew where we were going, he knew we were moving to reconcile. And he knew good and well that it was a total violation of international law to murder people who were in unarmed airplanes.

AMY GOODMAN: How do you justify imposing the embargo against Cuba and lifting it against China, normalizing relations with China?

PRESIDENT CLINTON: Well, first of all, China hasn't killed any of our pilots lately. They haven't murdered any Americans - as a matter of fact, the United States accidentally and tragically killed some Chinese citizens during our military campaign in Kosovo. And we have differences with China that we think can best be resolved. China is a nuclear power, and we think they have missile capacity. We have worked very hard with them to reduce the ... the threats of sales of missiles to renegade states, to ... to make the world a safer place. And they've worked with us on peace on the Korean peninsula, to help the North Korean situation.

And we would ... as I said, I believe if Castro hadn't shot those planes down, and the Congress hadn't passed a law which prohibits me from doing anything with the embargo, that we might have made some real progress there. But it ... sooner or later this is going to happen, and the sooner the better. The sooner we can be reconciled with the people of Cuba, the better. But Mr. Castro is going to have to make some changes, and, you know, you can't keep just throwing people in jail for human rights violations and expect the United States to do nothing with this huge Cuban population here. I hope that we can make some more progress.

And believe me, it would have happened if he hadn't shot those planes down. And sometimes I wonder if he shot them down just to make sure the embargo couldn't be lifted, because as long as he can blame the United States, then he doesn't have to answer to his own people for the failures of his economic policy. I wish it were different and maybe it will be under the next administration.

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